Talk:Mother's Helping Hand/Rules/Point System

So, basically a points system designed to guide the writers in how difficult they should make it? I actually think it's a good idea because I have noticed I have a bit of a tendency to make the situation work out for the MC no matter what. Having a point system that tells me it won't work will allow my mind to stop looking for ways to make it work and start looking for ways that it will fail due to the fact the numbers say it just doesn't work.

All that said, I think we need to have some of the points in action to see how it goes. Maybe make some modifications based on how it all works out. And, actually, I would like to run the points on Amanda House since I have made some changes to her motivation behind looking up all she knows about sex. Jemini (talk) 14:14, 9 March 2020 (CET)

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Great yeah do that and let me know, we might have to tweak numbers or add more modifiers to make sure the girls fall where they should. Okay did the numbers for Mom and Lori. As the points currently stand Lori has 10 pts, Mom has 6 1/2. However she lost a half point due to the deep rooted known pedo, and impregnation fetishes we put into the latest stuff with Dannie, if she gets more fetishes or the ones she has move up surface, meaning she embrace's them, her points will drop fast. So at the start of the story she is a strong 7 currently dropping to a 5 1/2 to 6 1/2. telgar (talk) 06:17, 9 March 2020 (PST)

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So I was thinking instead of flooding the points page with calculations once we get it hashed out, we just add a number under the pic in the bio. That gives the points at the start of the story and writers can adjust as they write. Also any permanent point changes caused by what is written can be mentioned in the start of the talk of the effecting page. For example:

Maredith Martin - 1/2 pt. Total 6 pt.

Deep Rooted Known fetish: -1/4 pt.

Deep Rooted Known fetish: -1/4 pt.

Added this chapter.

telgar (talk) 06:17, 9 March 2020 (PST)

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Just corrected some bad math with Aunt Lori there. It looks like you added the negatives on her instead of subtracting them.Jemini (talk) 15:07, 9 March 2020 (CET)

I think I'm going to work up the Deverux twins now. I want to also add "Hellen Moon's mind manipulation" to the mix as their own class of negatives, but I would like to figure that one up after I've worked up the Deverux twin's base point value so I can balance it so they are currently either a 1/2 or a 1 on the mind control route. Jemini (talk) 15:12, 9 March 2020 (CET)

Would Allister be 99 points? Basically, the only way to initially fuck Jodie would be to knock her unconscious and then once Jodie takes over, she has her own point value of 0-3 --MrPib (talk) 15:22, 9 March 2020 (CET)

Another thing to take into account, would be points added by mental resolve (meditation/martial arts training) --MrPib (talk) 15:26, 9 March 2020 (CET)

As someone who has had martial arts experience, what martial arts does is it makes you more comfortable with who you are. It does not make you more stubborn. Mostly, it mellows you and at the same time also makes you more confident. If there is anything to be added for that, it would probably go in the reversible section. Something like "true confidence." Might also add a "shallow/false confidence" to that as well.

BTW: You counted Celestial/Deity on Hellen Moon twice, I fixed that up a little. Jemini (talk) 15:33, 9 March 2020 (CET)

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That was on purpose with Helen, one was for race, one was for Religion Celestial Beings should be hard to seduce. As for Alistair he is a 6. Only because his body is under the compulsion to mate, with enough work the hormones and compulsion could override him.

telgar (talk) 07:42, 9 March 2020 (PST)

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That still feels pretty cheaty to me. It seems like there's a few mental gymnastics there in order to count the same thing twice. Being a celestial deity herself, she wouldn't have a religion. Rather, she would define it. If she's supposed to be hard to seduce, there's probably a need to find some other points to add in there that would make more sense. Jemini (talk) 15:51, 9 March 2020 (CET)

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Okay good point changes Celestial/Dirty Race to Otherworldly, so it applies to all Otherworldly beings, not just Celestial. telgar (talk) 08:11, 9 March 2020 (PST)

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Ok, I wound up making the mind-controlled Deverux twins a 1 1/2 point conquest. Well, I guess that can still work. It mostly reflects the points required to make it consensual sex, and this route had a lot of talk about going either way with them in terms of consent Vs. non-consent. So, that actually works out almost exactly right. (Having Hellen awaken their carnal desires and desire for motherhood ought to bring them to a zero, but she means this to be a test for Jack as well as a punishment for the girls so there's actually no way she'd do either of those.) Jemini (talk) 16:33, 9 March 2020 (CET)

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I decided to draw a distinction between "no sexual knowledge" and "zero sexual knowledge," based around whether or not they know what boys have "down there." Considering they more or less grow up in an all-girls boarding school, it's actually not that hard for a girl with no brothers (especially younger brothers) to have zero sexual knowledge and not find out about penises until their freshman sex-ed class unless they happen to have older friends willing to talk about the subject. Jemini (talk) 14:49, 11 March 2020 (CET)

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Decided to make the older cousins "doubting" their religion, or at least the sexual aspects of it, due to their mother's actions. Jemini (talk) 14:49, 11 March 2020 (CET)

Alpha Male v/s Beta Male v/s Omega Male

You seem to be confusing Beta Males with Omega Males. This is how this wolf analogy of human male classification plays out:

• Alpha Males: Alpha Males are extremely confident, with the most extreme examples going to levels of egocentricity that borders on megalomania. Alpha Males often get a lot of women, as confidence is generally attractive to females. Alpha Males are leaders. In popular culture, the Alpha Male is often portrayed as being overconfident, insensitive, and generally . . . a prick. This is somewhat true, but not a requirement of being an Alpha Male. It's all about confidence.
• Beta Males: Beta Males are followers. Beta Males get their confidence from following an Alpha; either by following their directives or following their examples. They do not lack confidence so much as have to borrow it from an Alpha. A good example is the lackeys of an Alpha bully. They bully kids because their Alpha does. In the absence of their Alpha they still seem confident, and the bully's Betas still bully others; but they are at their weakest when separated from their Alpha. This is when you can actually get through to a Beta, and try to curb the Alpha's control over them.
• Omega Males: Omega Males are social outcasts. They generally have very poor social skills, low self-esteem, and few friends. This is often attributed to a lack of a strong father figure. Omegas have little to no confidence. Most classic "Nerds" are Omega Males. The way you describe Jack, he seems more like an Omega then a Beta.

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You can blame the internet culture, the internet vernacular has changed the definition of Beta to be synonymous with Omega. However, I had mostly gone along with that change of definition because I did not realize there was an original proper definition for "beta," and thought it was just a new term being used instead of "omega." I likely would have protested this change in definition harder if I'd realized, but it is something that has happened at this point.

That said, fixing it in this story would require a fair amount of work. I am probably going to have to think about that a little, or even if it's worth the effort. Jemini (talk) 16:46, 12 March 2020 (CET)

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Though it is incorrect, I'm good with using Beta the way we are, for one, mom is playing Aloha right now, and two I think most readers would understand Beta more than Omega in this context, due to the before mentioned social change of the definition. telgar (talk) 04:05, 12 March 2020 (PST)

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I modified the conquest points to all be relative to Jack's current level instead of saying "girl this score counts like this or doesn't count any points." It's all resolved if Jack's just assigned a point value and it says the points only count if the girl is his point value or higher. Jemini (talk) 16:14, 13 March 2020 (CET)

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I would suggest that Ava and Ema being forced to watch their mothers "Special" time with Daddy, would count as traumatic sexual encounter, since they frequently hide to avoid it and are forced by their mother out of hidding to watch, it's repeatedly done when they are home, and the girls sometimes cry after. So I bumped their points. Dannie does not get the points even though she hides too, because she doesn't fully understand what's happening and only hides because her sisters tell her to.

So far story wise no details have come forward as to how much they are forced to watch, I'm my mind as of now it's only the initial beginning where the watch there father blindfolded and gaged in various humiliating positions and being degrad by her. She probably has them quietly leave before she starts any of the hard stuff. But in the end it will be up to the writer who tackles their story to decide just how much the have seen.

They are also not allowed to make a sound to alert their father that they are there, and have probably been threatened with punishment by their mother if they do. So if they start to cry while watching, they have to do so quietly. telgar (talk) 04:05, 12 March 2020 (PST)

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Holy fuck, did Erica for shots and grins -7, she is literally ready to breed him before she even meets him. --Telgar (talk) 20:37, 15 March 2020 (CET)

You might as well do her friend the gnome girl. I could see an option where Jack picks the gnome and Erica basically asks real bluntly and openly "if you're gonna fuck her, can you fuck me too?" And then allow a choice to fuck both of them. --MrPib (talk) 22:13, 15 March 2020 (CET)